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	<title>Comments on: Missionary Pies?</title>
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	<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/</link>
	<description>Liberty, if it means anything, is the right to tell people what they don&#039;t want to hear</description>
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		<title>By: mettaculture</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-4/#comment-412986</link>
		<dc:creator>mettaculture</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 14:45:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412986</guid>
		<description>Edward Stone

You are quite wrong.

The foundation of Isreali Law (apart of course from statutes laid down by parliament the Knesset) is Ottoman very very Ottoman.

In fact it represents a continutaion of the millet system a polity of  communalised or pillarised religious communities seen as quasi ethnicities each to be governed by their own laws, councils and leaders.

Now of course this kind of multiculturalism as diversity governed through unequal laws and their application through manipulatedly enfranchised communal entities was very much liked by the British Empire indeed it is a consitutionalisation of divide and rule.

The British introduced the all India Muslim Personal Law Act in the 1930&#039;s as a sop to the activist Muslim League.

It contributed quite a bit to partition, to the idea that there could not be one country for Muslims and Hindus.

Because of this at independence it was left alone for fear of further disharmony.

It has meant that there is not and probably never can be a unified civil Law in India, a pretty disastrous outcome.

If you want to see the harm this has caused and the impact it has had on all Indians including Hindus then google &#039;Shah Bano&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Edward Stone</p>
<p>You are quite wrong.</p>
<p>The foundation of Isreali Law (apart of course from statutes laid down by parliament the Knesset) is Ottoman very very Ottoman.</p>
<p>In fact it represents a continutaion of the millet system a polity of  communalised or pillarised religious communities seen as quasi ethnicities each to be governed by their own laws, councils and leaders.</p>
<p>Now of course this kind of multiculturalism as diversity governed through unequal laws and their application through manipulatedly enfranchised communal entities was very much liked by the British Empire indeed it is a consitutionalisation of divide and rule.</p>
<p>The British introduced the all India Muslim Personal Law Act in the 1930&#8217;s as a sop to the activist Muslim League.</p>
<p>It contributed quite a bit to partition, to the idea that there could not be one country for Muslims and Hindus.</p>
<p>Because of this at independence it was left alone for fear of further disharmony.</p>
<p>It has meant that there is not and probably never can be a unified civil Law in India, a pretty disastrous outcome.</p>
<p>If you want to see the harm this has caused and the impact it has had on all Indians including Hindus then google &#8216;Shah Bano&#8217;</p>
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		<title>By: S.O.Muffin</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-4/#comment-412919</link>
		<dc:creator>S.O.Muffin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 10:57:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412919</guid>
		<description>Amie: Thank you for your clarification. I agree, Judy is not a thief. She is a hypocrite and a racist (or at least many of her comments are), applying different standards to Jews and non-Jews, wishing to discriminate against non-Jewish Israeli citizens, supporting colonial settlements in Occupied Territories. But I agree, she is not a thief.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amie: Thank you for your clarification. I agree, Judy is not a thief. She is a hypocrite and a racist (or at least many of her comments are), applying different standards to Jews and non-Jews, wishing to discriminate against non-Jewish Israeli citizens, supporting colonial settlements in Occupied Territories. But I agree, she is not a thief.</p>
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		<title>By: Edward Stone</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-3/#comment-412855</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward Stone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 04:48:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412855</guid>
		<description>Now that the issue has been raised, a comparison of Israel with India is instructive. The US Commission on International Religious Freedom has cited India for failure to protect religious minorities. Many states - Chhattisgarth, Madhya Pradesh, Himachal Pradesh, Gujarat and Arunachal Pradesh, among others - have laws to prevent or restrict conversions, and have been criticised for this by the US State Department. Outrightly restricting conversion is far more serious than Israel&#039;s simple issue of a kashrut certificate.

I look forward to the HP article on &quot;India&#039;s Religious Fascists&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now that the issue has been raised, a comparison of Israel with India is instructive. The US Commission on International Religious Freedom has cited India for failure to protect religious minorities. Many states &#8211; Chhattisgarth, Madhya Pradesh, Himachal Pradesh, Gujarat and Arunachal Pradesh, among others &#8211; have laws to prevent or restrict conversions, and have been criticised for this by the US State Department. Outrightly restricting conversion is far more serious than Israel&#8217;s simple issue of a kashrut certificate.</p>
<p>I look forward to the HP article on &#8220;India&#8217;s Religious Fascists&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Edward Stone</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-3/#comment-412850</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward Stone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 04:12:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412850</guid>
		<description>By the way, it is also incredible that Mirax just referred to the Jewish experience of the Holocaust as &quot;self-pitying&quot; memory of &quot;historical wrongs&quot;. That&#039;s quite a cavalier dismissal of Christian Europe&#039;s murder of an entire people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way, it is also incredible that Mirax just referred to the Jewish experience of the Holocaust as &#8220;self-pitying&#8221; memory of &#8220;historical wrongs&#8221;. That&#8217;s quite a cavalier dismissal of Christian Europe&#8217;s murder of an entire people.</p>
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		<title>By: Edward Stone</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-3/#comment-412849</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward Stone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 04:10:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412849</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt; The Indian constitution was written by the brilliant Dr Ambedkar, a dalit and I’d be very surprised if it contained anything like the kind of nasty religious discrimination Stone so fervently favours for Israel.&lt;/i&gt;

So, finally we get to the core - ths poster revels in ignorance, seeing India as morally superior to Israel.

Except that Israel also has a set of basic laws functioning as a constitution.

With Israeli law being substantially similar to Indian law - both based on English common law as introduced by colonial administration, both delegating much of personal status to individual communities.

Except that Israel hasn&#039;t mudered Muslims en masse as did India at Partition, or more recently in the Gujarat riots.

The double standards here, and pure hypocrisy, are incredible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i> The Indian constitution was written by the brilliant Dr Ambedkar, a dalit and I’d be very surprised if it contained anything like the kind of nasty religious discrimination Stone so fervently favours for Israel.</i></p>
<p>So, finally we get to the core &#8211; ths poster revels in ignorance, seeing India as morally superior to Israel.</p>
<p>Except that Israel also has a set of basic laws functioning as a constitution.</p>
<p>With Israeli law being substantially similar to Indian law &#8211; both based on English common law as introduced by colonial administration, both delegating much of personal status to individual communities.</p>
<p>Except that Israel hasn&#8217;t mudered Muslims en masse as did India at Partition, or more recently in the Gujarat riots.</p>
<p>The double standards here, and pure hypocrisy, are incredible.</p>
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		<title>By: Edward Stone</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-3/#comment-412847</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward Stone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 04:05:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412847</guid>
		<description>Mirax

&lt;i&gt;your brand of selfpitying rationalising over historical wrongs&lt;/i&gt;

I&#039;m not Jewish. What does it say about you that you assumed me so?

&lt;i&gt;have gone on to murder muslims and christian converts in India&lt;/i&gt;

So now Jews in Israel are responsible for Hindu crimes in India?

To my knowledge, Jews have never placed Christians in ovens, nor have any plans to do so.

Once again we have a poster here equating a kashrut cert with mass murder. I wonder what we call a double-standard imputing to Jews the crimes of others?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mirax</p>
<p><i>your brand of selfpitying rationalising over historical wrongs</i></p>
<p>I&#8217;m not Jewish. What does it say about you that you assumed me so?</p>
<p><i>have gone on to murder muslims and christian converts in India</i></p>
<p>So now Jews in Israel are responsible for Hindu crimes in India?</p>
<p>To my knowledge, Jews have never placed Christians in ovens, nor have any plans to do so.</p>
<p>Once again we have a poster here equating a kashrut cert with mass murder. I wonder what we call a double-standard imputing to Jews the crimes of others?</p>
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		<title>By: mirax</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-3/#comment-412841</link>
		<dc:creator>mirax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 03:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412841</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;One would think, under those circumstances, Christianity would have the decency or humility to keep a low profile in the Jewish state itself – but it does not. One wonders why it is so essential to propagate Christianity in tiny Israel, with one billion Indians and one billion Chinese to convert.&gt;&gt;

I personally detest christian evangelism and muslim theocracy  and would love to see these two religions disappear first before all the others. But if you value freedom of conscience and the right to practise your religion for your group, you must allow it for everyone else. Some hindu extremists hate christians and muslims too, and with exactly your brand of selfpitying rationalising over historical wrongs, have gone on to murder muslims and christian converts in India. They are absolutely wrong.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&gt;One would think, under those circumstances, Christianity would have the decency or humility to keep a low profile in the Jewish state itself – but it does not. One wonders why it is so essential to propagate Christianity in tiny Israel, with one billion Indians and one billion Chinese to convert.&gt;&gt;</p>
<p>I personally detest christian evangelism and muslim theocracy  and would love to see these two religions disappear first before all the others. But if you value freedom of conscience and the right to practise your religion for your group, you must allow it for everyone else. Some hindu extremists hate christians and muslims too, and with exactly your brand of selfpitying rationalising over historical wrongs, have gone on to murder muslims and christian converts in India. They are absolutely wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: mirax</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-3/#comment-412839</link>
		<dc:creator>mirax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 03:12:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412839</guid>
		<description>Amie is very selective in her outrage on judy&#039;s behalf.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amie is very selective in her outrage on judy&#8217;s behalf.</p>
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		<title>By: mirax</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-3/#comment-412838</link>
		<dc:creator>mirax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 03:11:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412838</guid>
		<description>Just to be fair to the brahmins, the brahmins arent the only or even the worst offenders when it comes to caste discrimination and violence against the dalits - even the middling castes and officially backward castes (OBCs) practise untouchability against  the dalits in places like tamil nadu.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just to be fair to the brahmins, the brahmins arent the only or even the worst offenders when it comes to caste discrimination and violence against the dalits &#8211; even the middling castes and officially backward castes (OBCs) practise untouchability against  the dalits in places like tamil nadu.</p>
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		<title>By: mirax</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2009/11/21/missionary-pies/comment-page-3/#comment-412835</link>
		<dc:creator>mirax</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 03:05:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/?p=24205#comment-412835</guid>
		<description>Metta, you were too kind to the brahmin bloodsuckers. You should know what the  atheistic, anti-hindu Dravida Munnetra Kazhagam movement( of which my dad was a card carrying member) did to Tamil brahmins, so the  telegus should be grateful. I am the sort of woman who deliberately feeds her hindu mum beef, and as a teenager actually  waved a soiled sanitary napkin around the family prayer room, so melodramatic taboo slaying gestures are irresistible to me. 

India preserved minority rights at Independence by keeping personal civil laws for Muslims, sikhs and christians  (which some consider a mistake in retrospect) but arbitrarily abolished hindu personal law (a very good move imo). Apart from muslims, the rest generally get by pretty well with secular civil law. The Indian constitution was written by the brilliant Dr Ambedkar, a dalit and I&#039;d be very surprised if it contained  anything like the kind of nasty religious discrimination Stone so fervently favours for Israel.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Metta, you were too kind to the brahmin bloodsuckers. You should know what the  atheistic, anti-hindu Dravida Munnetra Kazhagam movement( of which my dad was a card carrying member) did to Tamil brahmins, so the  telegus should be grateful. I am the sort of woman who deliberately feeds her hindu mum beef, and as a teenager actually  waved a soiled sanitary napkin around the family prayer room, so melodramatic taboo slaying gestures are irresistible to me. </p>
<p>India preserved minority rights at Independence by keeping personal civil laws for Muslims, sikhs and christians  (which some consider a mistake in retrospect) but arbitrarily abolished hindu personal law (a very good move imo). Apart from muslims, the rest generally get by pretty well with secular civil law. The Indian constitution was written by the brilliant Dr Ambedkar, a dalit and I&#8217;d be very surprised if it contained  anything like the kind of nasty religious discrimination Stone so fervently favours for Israel.</p>
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