“we are quite clearly talking about members of the Labour party who held his background against him rather than the electorate.”

Well, I think there were plenty of the sort you mention, Graham, like myself, who gritted our teeth and voted for the guy because he was the Labour candidate. I can’t stand the man, but I voted for him for because he was a great deal more interested in the average Londoner and their lives and concerns than some Etonian Tory twat. (Note: not all Etonians are twats, nor even all Tories, but to be both of those things does rather increase the possibility that that might be so.) I never disliked Livingstone because of his background, and I’m sure those of similar views to me who couldn’t bring themselves to back him didn’t fail to Do The Right Thing because of his background.

Generally, though, as ever, you are getting in trouble for saying provocatively sensible things. I occasionally wonder if I should be concerned that a generally pro-Blairite, pro-liberation left blog that so aptly mirrors my own opinions should attract so many barking right-wing wingnuts as commenters. But then I get distracted and put it to the back of my mind.

Benji v Nearly Oxfordian? Was it Kissinger who said he wished both protagonists of the Iran-Iraq war could lose?

“Liberty, if it means anything, is the right to make up any old shit in an effort to back yer mate”

In that case it should have a picture of Gene and Timmy competitively fellating Obama.

“Liberty, if it means anything, is the right to make up any old shit in an effort to back yer mate”

apparently.

No need. The context was very clear and Morgoth was talking about the adult students who I teach.

Which of the electorate held that against him in voting him out Graham?

Again this is a total miss in terms of the discussion. Because a) Livingstone’s vote was up and b) we are quite clearly talking about members of the Labour party who held his background against him rather than the electorate.

Now I realise that for many the chance to attack (at every opportunity) someone whose background is working-class is far more interesting than discussing the issues of the post but please have some respect for Brett who made it clear above that he wanted to talk about Martin Bright and Gordon Brown.

Which of the electorate held that against him in voting him out Graham? Which of them knew or cared where he was educated?
Ken’s problem was epitomised by Lee Jasper and all who sailed in him and his ill judged support for Sir Ian Blair.

Define ’succeeds’. There are plenty of people born to money, and those who with charm and chutzpa but no work to speak off do very well.