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	<title>Comments on: Policy Exchange: Libel Reform Conference</title>
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	<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/</link>
	<description>Liberty, if it means anything, is the right to tell people what they don&#039;t want to hear</description>
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		<title>By: quisquis</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-210042</link>
		<dc:creator>quisquis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jul 2008 15:03:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-210042</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I mean a witch was well known to argue that they were not guilty of witchcraft.

But given the seriousness of sorcery no person of goodwill would make such an unfounded allegation.&lt;/i&gt;

This is not the case. Historians of witchcraft now suggest that many accusations of witchcraft were the culmination of long disputes among neighbours, some lasting as long as twenty years. Belief that a person was really a witch was hardly a prerequisite. 

So make sure that lelandii of yours is trimmed back.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I mean a witch was well known to argue that they were not guilty of witchcraft.</p>
<p>But given the seriousness of sorcery no person of goodwill would make such an unfounded allegation.</i></p>
<p>This is not the case. Historians of witchcraft now suggest that many accusations of witchcraft were the culmination of long disputes among neighbours, some lasting as long as twenty years. Belief that a person was really a witch was hardly a prerequisite. </p>
<p>So make sure that lelandii of yours is trimmed back.</p>
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		<title>By: ami</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-209689</link>
		<dc:creator>ami</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 23:40:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-209689</guid>
		<description>David T: You don&#039;t say what it is you remember her well for.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David T: You don&#8217;t say what it is you remember her well for.</p>
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		<title>By: ami</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-209676</link>
		<dc:creator>ami</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 22:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-209676</guid>
		<description>New Statesman blog, that is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>New Statesman blog, that is.</p>
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		<title>By: ami</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-209672</link>
		<dc:creator>ami</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 22:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-209672</guid>
		<description>Further update; Martin Bright has quoted this post in Libel Tourism Revisited in today&#039;s New Statesman.
http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/martin-bright/2008/07/anthony-julius-libel</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Further update; Martin Bright has quoted this post in Libel Tourism Revisited in today&#8217;s New Statesman.<br />
<a href="http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/martin-bright/2008/07/anthony-julius-libel" rel="nofollow">http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/martin-bright/2008/07/anthony-julius-libel</a></p>
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		<title>By: ami</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-209661</link>
		<dc:creator>ami</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 20:47:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-209661</guid>
		<description>Charlieman: I agree with you: Tweed&#039;s response on this was a little too glib.

mettaculture: I agree with your proposals for reform regarding ISPs. They are currently in an inviduous position as you know, under the Defamation Act as interpreted by Godfrey v Demon. On the one hand to qualify as a mere conduit, the ISP has to be completely hands off, but on the other,the interpretation has deteriorated into the received wisdom that the moment an aggrieved person informs the ISP of the allegedly defamatory material, the ISP is in breach of the obligation to &quot;take reasonable care in relation of its publication, etc, unless he takes it down at once. , This has to be challenged.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Charlieman: I agree with you: Tweed&#8217;s response on this was a little too glib.</p>
<p>mettaculture: I agree with your proposals for reform regarding ISPs. They are currently in an inviduous position as you know, under the Defamation Act as interpreted by Godfrey v Demon. On the one hand to qualify as a mere conduit, the ISP has to be completely hands off, but on the other,the interpretation has deteriorated into the received wisdom that the moment an aggrieved person informs the ISP of the allegedly defamatory material, the ISP is in breach of the obligation to &#8220;take reasonable care in relation of its publication, etc, unless he takes it down at once. , This has to be challenged.</p>
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		<title>By: Charlieman</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-209655</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlieman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 20:12:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-209655</guid>
		<description>Ahead of my comments, I must thank Ami for an illuminating post.

Anthony Julius apparently said:
&quot;The papers can afford to fight; celebrity cases are fought for huge fees.&quot;

With what evidence? Which broadsheets make a profit? Which red tops make a profit? If you add up daily sales in either category, the losers outnumber or roughly equal the winners. Why would a vanity publisher of a national newspaper (ie most of them) risk a confrontation and financial loss in the courts? 

Ami wrote about another: &quot;Paul Tweed, a Northern Ireland lawyer who acts for many celebrities in libel actions, said the main reason Ehrenfeld didn’t defend was the risk of costs, but if she believed she was right, she would have got her costs if she won.&quot;

But as the oft quoted Sonia Sutcliffe vs Private Eye case demonstrates, courts may be perverse in their judgement. [The following argument does not apply to the Sutcliffe case.] Five paragraphs of damning evidence in a book may be offset in the jurors&#039; eyes by a minor slip on the next page. In UK English grammar, a misplaced apostrophe is sufficient to provide two meanings to a sentence. Libel juries are a gamble for the claimant and defendent. Consequently, UK libel law serves neither party, but provides a healthy income to some lawyers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ahead of my comments, I must thank Ami for an illuminating post.</p>
<p>Anthony Julius apparently said:<br />
&#8220;The papers can afford to fight; celebrity cases are fought for huge fees.&#8221;</p>
<p>With what evidence? Which broadsheets make a profit? Which red tops make a profit? If you add up daily sales in either category, the losers outnumber or roughly equal the winners. Why would a vanity publisher of a national newspaper (ie most of them) risk a confrontation and financial loss in the courts? </p>
<p>Ami wrote about another: &#8220;Paul Tweed, a Northern Ireland lawyer who acts for many celebrities in libel actions, said the main reason Ehrenfeld didn’t defend was the risk of costs, but if she believed she was right, she would have got her costs if she won.&#8221;</p>
<p>But as the oft quoted Sonia Sutcliffe vs Private Eye case demonstrates, courts may be perverse in their judgement. [The following argument does not apply to the Sutcliffe case.] Five paragraphs of damning evidence in a book may be offset in the jurors&#8217; eyes by a minor slip on the next page. In UK English grammar, a misplaced apostrophe is sufficient to provide two meanings to a sentence. Libel juries are a gamble for the claimant and defendent. Consequently, UK libel law serves neither party, but provides a healthy income to some lawyers.</p>
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		<title>By: Brett</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-209651</link>
		<dc:creator>Brett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:38:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-209651</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;&quot;Way back in SA there was a senior prosecutor we all knew with a drink problem who was stopped for drink driving on the way back from the prosecutor’s Xmas party.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

This scenario repeated itself recently when the chief of the Metro Police crashed his car while drunk while returning from a function. His solution was to get his minders to threaten all witnesses, including apparently the rank-and-file police officers who arrived to investate. He was in good company though, not long afterwards a Supreme Court Judge was captured on a mobile phone video in a drunken rant after crashing his luxury car into someone&#039;s garden wall.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8220;Way back in SA there was a senior prosecutor we all knew with a drink problem who was stopped for drink driving on the way back from the prosecutor’s Xmas party.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>This scenario repeated itself recently when the chief of the Metro Police crashed his car while drunk while returning from a function. His solution was to get his minders to threaten all witnesses, including apparently the rank-and-file police officers who arrived to investate. He was in good company though, not long afterwards a Supreme Court Judge was captured on a mobile phone video in a drunken rant after crashing his luxury car into someone&#8217;s garden wall.</p>
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		<title>By: ami</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-209639</link>
		<dc:creator>ami</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 18:38:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-209639</guid>
		<description>mettaculture: what an appalling story about your Texas experience. I can vouch for the way you can get away with those non scientific drunkeness tests. Way back in SA there was a senior prosecutor we all knew with a drink problem who was stopped for drink driving on the way back from the prosecutor&#039;s Xmas party. He was drunk. He refused to take the test (can&#039;t remember if it was blood or breathalyser,) and was able to stand on one foot with his eyes closed, walk the line and explain away the nystagmus. He got away with it and later went to the bar (as an advocate, I mean).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mettaculture: what an appalling story about your Texas experience. I can vouch for the way you can get away with those non scientific drunkeness tests. Way back in SA there was a senior prosecutor we all knew with a drink problem who was stopped for drink driving on the way back from the prosecutor&#8217;s Xmas party. He was drunk. He refused to take the test (can&#8217;t remember if it was blood or breathalyser,) and was able to stand on one foot with his eyes closed, walk the line and explain away the nystagmus. He got away with it and later went to the bar (as an advocate, I mean).</p>
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		<title>By: ami</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-2/#comment-209612</link>
		<dc:creator>ami</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:47:41 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Brett- thank you for pointing out to resistor what is clear to everyone else. But you have momentarily forgotten that minds like resistors are only capable of simple binary notions. For war, against war; that kind of thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brett- thank you for pointing out to resistor what is clear to everyone else. But you have momentarily forgotten that minds like resistors are only capable of simple binary notions. For war, against war; that kind of thing.</p>
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		<title>By: David Boothroyd</title>
		<link>http://hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/comment-page-1/#comment-209594</link>
		<dc:creator>David Boothroyd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 17:19:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.hurryupharry.org/2008/07/22/policy-exchange-libel-reform-conference/#comment-209594</guid>
		<description>Insider, I do not see why I should respond to anonymous insinuations but I can tell you there is no tension at all. If Indigo has anything in Westminster (and it does not at present), I do not work on it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Insider, I do not see why I should respond to anonymous insinuations but I can tell you there is no tension at all. If Indigo has anything in Westminster (and it does not at present), I do not work on it.</p>
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